When can a kid go to bathroom himself?

Our 4 yr old daughter sometimes has to got to the washroom with Daddy in the mall. Generally he prefers to take her to the handicapped one if available, but sometimes this is not possible. A few days back she tried to stand and pee, as she had observed in the men's washroom. We were both shocked to see this , but later we just could not stop laughing. But then again, we would still not send her alone to the washroom just for this reason that she might be curious to see what's happening in the men's washroom. The safety of our child is our first concern, and we don't mind if anyone thinks we are being over protective, but then that's how most parents are.
 
There are many of us who do not make a decision on 'What If's alone. I hate it when people come in an insinuate that women are irrational and make irrational decisions based on hype.

This is an example of how I, as a mum. would make my decision.

Last year:

(1) Circulated amongst Mothersgroup - Watch out for the 'Yellow Backpack' man who regularly hangs out at Repulse Bay cafes. He has a newspaper on his lap and making gestures inappropriate under the newspaper as he watches children.

Personal Experiences from 2006 in HK
(1) 2006 - Tsuen Wan, outside the lifts for the EDB office, with school going children, a man watches the children while he burns the breasts of women in a soft porn magazine he had. Done openly in front of us. No fear.

(2) 2010 - While at Repulse Bay Beach, a man hid in the change room, to peer overhead to the cubicle next door at my friend who was changing out of the swimmers. When she yelled, no one came to her rescue. The guards were told and they shrugged it off and said that it happens regularly.

(3) 2011 - My colleague, the most decently dressed girl, caught a man using his camera filming her 'upskirt' getting on the bus.

ALL not reported in the media. AND, ALL not expected experiences in HK. I did what any rational PERSON would do. I also DO NOT WORK in an office and amongst the grassroots where I see a LOT of parents and children having to deal with psychological disorders. The fact that it is brushed off as common in HK, I'd better to be safe than sorry.

Irrational, no I am not. Cautious. YES! Most of us here I think are simply sensible parents. And will make our decisions based on each child's maturity and street saviness. NOT on paranoia and What Ifs. Just basic sensibility.
 
Could you please explain to me why do you classify the above incidents as somehow related to safety.
Clearly these people are a bit disturbed and need help but what actual harm (physical or otherwise) did these incidents pose to the general population or to the little children that may have been around?
 
What can you expect from disturbed people like these if they see a child alone in the washroom? I would classify them as dangerous for my child.
 
my kids play outside in our village all day most sundays. they only come home for drinks and snacks, then they are out again. they have a ball with all of our neighbours....what does that have to do with them going into a public toilet by themselves?
 
I thought we moved on from the toilets as someone earlier started pointing out people on the bus, beach and other random places acting and doing funny things implying that this was somehow dangerous. Someone else then chimed in to reaffirm this was dangerous to their child and I thought it provided a good place to insert a small bit of sanity from Time magazine and Lenore.

Glad to see that not everyone subscribes to the scaremongering and you allow your kids to play outside freely. Wish more people did the same.
 
I would definitely not send a small child to the men's bathroom by himself in a busy public space with many strangers around -- not if I (or another relative / friend) couldn't see him, and there were closed spaces like toilet or changing stalls. That is very different than an open space like a park, where I (and other people) can see what's happening.

Howard, I don't think it's paranoid to say that a 3-6-year-old probably doesn't belong in a crowded Hong Kong men's public toilet by himself. And I'm a pretty relaxed mom.

Are you trying to be sarcastic? No, of course there is no "magic" age. But we all know that young children are less aware when something inappropriate is happening -- a stranger touches them, or leads them away by the hand, or an older boy tries to bully or rob him. Tots are lighter, easier to carry away, weaker, and might not shout for help like an older child. Even if there is nothing as serious as a molester, 3-year-olds have a tendency to decide they're done peeing and wander away.

I come from a laid-back family. But my mom had to call the police once when she lost me in a huge crowd when I was 4, let go of her hand and wandered away into traffic. Yeah, I'd keep a 3-to-6-year-old within eyesight in any crowded public place in the middle of the city, even if it means a small boy in the women's bathroom.

I've never seen anyone complain about this before, in HK or overseas.
 
Howard -- I think you're also being dismissive of intuition (and of the Quasimother)
Even pretty relaxed, friendly people have our feelers out for creeps, weirdos. Even kids feel it.
I grew up in an extremely safe small town, where we were free to play outside.
But if some strange man was around the park, staring at kids, filming kids in a suspicious fashion, reading porn, generally being a creep, we'd get the hell away. Any parent with any sense would gently shoo the kids off somewhere else.
I mean, wouldn't you? It's just common sense.
And there's a pretty big difference between taking an 8-year-old somewhere and a 14-year-old.
 
OK I had been searching for the article, but the original one is in Chinese and I've only found this terrible translation of an incident that occurred last year when a grandfather was minding his grand daughters and left them for a bit when he went to the toilet (she was 6), she was abducted, assaulted and left at a Macdonald's toilet.

http://www.gasvi.com/blog/blog.php?do=showone&uid=16148&type=blog&itemid=1751620

Now I know what you're going to say Howard and that it, this is a remote possibility and I'm sure that when gramps headed off to the toilet, that even he in his wildest dreams wouldn't have expected his grand daughter to have been taken BUT it happened. There are some things worth taking a calculated risk on and some things that are not. Each mother does a risk rating, this is one of those things that is UNLIKELY to occur but the consequences of which are EXTREME, so most would choose to be extra cautious. It doesn't make us paranoid nut jobs just sensible mums.
 
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