What is your child care plan?

[canadienne]

PT Helpers and co-ops

wow, it's scary to hear about what happens if you try for part time helpers. I've heard that there are locals who can be hired legally -- has anyone had any experience with that? I am curious about why it's not more popular.

I am especially curious about the unpopularity of a childcare co-op. I might guess it's that HK tends to be a very affluent society. My spouse and I are not in the banker/lawyer/doctor income category and so we have always thought of ourselves as people who would trade babysitting or send our kids to a "sitter" (ie. local SAHM) if we both had to work. I would guess, and I'm trying very hard to make it clear that I'm NOT judging, but I would guess that a lot of expats in HK had not always had this expectation and are therefore not as surprised as we are that it's unavailable!

We might still try to make a go of it if we can find other families with at least one spouse only working part-time, who are willing to share childcare, but it might be quite stressful (especially with scheduling!) and I can see why many people simply hire someone.

Further thoughts or advice?

 

[canadienne]

Thanka2, I think we were posting at exactly the same time -- thanks for the great detailed response -- can you please post the name/contact info of the charity? Thanks!

 

[LeahH]

I actually think the childcare options we do have here, while limited in their scope, are superior to the UK or NZ. 'In home' care is so much more affordable.

There are many studies out there that confirm instutionalised care for the under 3s (daycare, creches etc.) is not desirable - yet it is the norm because of cost. I haven't heard much about co-ops, just registered child-minders where someone looks after a group of children in their own home.

Ultimately, someone your child can truly bond with and can be cared for by in the home (after parents and family members which would of course be the first choice) is the ideal.

Even if I only worked part time (I work full time) I would still have a full time FDH as the freedom it allows me is amazing and I have someone who knows my kids schedules intimately (and who truly cares for them).

The illegal use of FDH's for part time work is so widespread, even if you tried to start a co-op I'm not sure how many takers you would get. Simillar to the scenario with 'live out' helpers, people weigh up the risks and make their decision accordingly.

Lesliefu raises a really good point though, you can't necessarily control who knows about your situation and how they could use it against you. It would a disaster to be blacklisted by immigration. Good incentive to be nice to your neighbours!

 

[Nashua852]

Like Starbucks2 I work part time and my husband has somewhat flexible work hours - starts work in the pm so he's home all morning with the kids. My mum lives in HK (neither me or my husband are local chinese) but I grew up here. When my son was around 9 months old I started work on a freelance basis at home but had to strictly regulate this around his naptimes and more often than not meant that I was up until 2am. Then when I had just fallen pregnant with my daughter when my son was around 15 months old I was working part time - a lot of it from home but as the project I was involved in grew so did my in-office time. We live in the boonies out in the NTs because frankly we like grass and are happy to escape at least for the mean time typical HK rental prices. So what this meant was every other day I'd be shipping my son out from Yuen Long to Hung Hom (where my mum lives) - this was before the new train line which now makes it a direct route; drop him off at hers, shlep my way to Central do my 3-4 hours, go back to Hung Hom, take him home and then end up working into the night because just because I had a meeting during the day it didnt mean I didnt have work to do when I got back home.

Add pregnancy to the mix and I had to stop and realize it was all just too much. Even on days when my mum would travel out to babysit it didn't make sense - I have a younger sister of school age and she was starting to get neglected because of my kids and it was becoming too much of a weight on my conscience.

Getting a helper was the right solution for us. It's given me and my husband A LOT of breathing room as parents and as a couple. I enjoy cooking more, I bake more with my son, and when I work from home its productive, I get a lot done and I get to go downstairs and enjoy my kids company without feeling like I'm being pulled in all directions. I stopped feeling as resentful of my wonderful husband who is a very hands on father as it is - but it was only natural as I had the house, the kids and a part time job to think of, juggling babysitting and trying to find more hours in the day.

Having a helper for me means that I also get to spend quality time with my kids individually. My toddler doesn't have to come along to my little one's jabs, my postnatals, etc. I'm really enjoying work now as well. I've always been the type of mum that loves her kids but gets itchy fingers. I love working and when I go to work I know that my daughter is getting her expressed milk on time and my son gets meals on time as I dont have to rush him back from my mums and THEN cook dinner or resort to a 7-11 sandwich.

Mind you, for us it is a significant loss in income - we're a young couple trying to save as much as we can as the kids popped out a lot earlier than expected but for us, having a helper is worth it.

I have less working mums guilt now ironically even though I'm pulling in more hours. My son responds to me better (daughter too young to tell) because of the quality of time we get to spend with each other, and I am at peace that my son isn't getting juggled between mine and my mum's place and he's getting the stability he deserves.

My 2 cents has once again run far too many paragraphs long. Good Luck whatever you choose!

 

[carang]

the minimum wage for a full-time, live-in helper is $3580/month. if you do not provide food for hte helper, the minimum food allowance is $740/month.

in addition, you must pay for your helper's flights to/from their "home". that is, one way to hk and one way back to "home.

you must also pay for insurance. this amounts to a few hundred $/year.

i would say that the total cost of our helper is about $4500/month. (we don't pay her minimum wage and she eats our food.)

because of this low-cost (relatively, when you compare to the cost of day care in other countries), there is not much demand for other options.

in addition to childcare, our helper does our laundry, cooks & cleans. she is a fantastic cook and makes our lives SOOOOOO much easier. because of her, the time i get to spend with my kids is real quality time. i don't have to worry about what is for dinner (usually) as she decides and takes care of it all.

we are actually waiting for the approval from immigration for the application for her husband to join us, too!

 

[spockey]

Thanka, do you still have the information for the local hired help? We are looking for someone to come in and babysit/teach our child basic Cantonese or Mandarin... one of his schoolmates (who is not local) found this the best way to learn Chinese. BTW, $50/hour is cheaper than an illegal domestic helper!

We live in a predominantly Chinese community and I can see that he's getting quite frustrated about not being to communicate. He cockles (seriously like a rooster) to the kids! He tells me that he is speaking Chinese.

 

[thanka2]

Hi Spockey, I think the $50 HKD/hour rate really only applies if you book the person for a certain number of hours a week and it may vary by where in HK you're looking--you do have to make it worth their while. So, if she comes for half-day (4 hours) 2-3 times/week then you could probably do the $50 HKD/hour thing. The price we negotiated with the lady who helped us was negotiated between us--the agency is only responsible to train and recommend help--they don't deal with the financial side of things. My Mandarin improved A LOT when the local lady was here with us (she is actually from Mainland China but married to a local man and a permanent resident here). I will look for the information again. The last time I saw the numbers and names for the agency was back 2 years ago!

 

[spockey]

Thanks Thanka. That would be ideal for us... a Mainlander who lives here.
I'm going to try and put an ad up at the local job network too.

 

[archery6]

Hi Thanka, would appreciate if you can PM me the information of the agency too.
Thank you!

 

[canadienne]

This is such a difficult decision to make because, ultimately, it's about what is best for our kids (or kids-to-be!) and that has to include what is best for our own sanity. I am hoping to find one or two other like-minded parents in my neighbourhood to share some childcare, and also really hoping that the part-time-but-legal situation works out. I know it's so, so common to hire through the illegal way, but for some reason it still sketches me out.

I wonder if this is the organization Thanka2 worked with:
Our Services > Co-operation with the Employees Retraining Board - Domestic Helper Retraining Course